A HUMBLE PROPOSAL: The ethos of humility “is really something we’ve lost — to our detriment,” author and columnist David Brooks said during a talk at the Aspen Ideas Festival in June.

When we talked three years ago, we spoke about social polarization. It seems like it hasn’t gotten anybetter; in fact, it’s getting worse. Is there anything that behavioral science has to sayabout howwe can come out from behind our separate sides? Yeah, I agree. It’s gottenworse. I lookbackat three years ago as a golden age. [Laughs.] You know, one of the things the research continually shows us is how little we know.Howlit- tle we know about ourselves, how little we know about how we are seeing the world, and how prone we are to overcon- fidence. And I thinkone of the reasons we’re so polarized is because we have this illusion that we know what to do and we know the truth and every- body who disagrees with us is just sort of in the way. If you pay attention to all the

evidence of how biased we are about ourselvesandhowwegive ourselves too much credit for knowing everything,you’d adapt to a more modest view of your- self and you’d realize you need people to disagree with you, to counteractyourownerrors.And

What are the biggest challenges in making use of the insights that behavioral science is bringing us? I still think that psychologists and sociologists have trouble think- ing about groups of people andhowto translate a lot of this into policy. I have been in several sessions recently where [psychol- ogists and sociologists are] asked by policy-makers, “What exactly can I do?”They still have to apply itmore.The findings have to be applied in practical terms to people who lead organ- izations. I thinkthat’s one of the big frontiers ahead—how to apply this stuff a littlemore.We know somuchmore about our- selves, but we haven’t quite figured out how to use it quite as much as we need to.

“One of the things the research shows us is howlittle we know about ourselves, how little we know about howwe are seeing the world, and how prone we are to overconfidence.”

that spirit is not exactly flourishing, especially inWashington.

I found the last sentence of your book striking. It included the phrase the “never-ending interpenetration of souls.” Could you talk a little bit about that? I do think thatwhat makes us happier, happiest, andwhat makes us best, is when we’re doing something with others or relating to others or we’re merging with others. And sometimes we get pushed away from that, but if you thinkabout the times that are most meaningful for most people, it’s those moments when they’ve forgotten about themselves, they’ve lost an awareness of themselves, and they’re doing something really challenging or they’re part of a team that’s working smoothly together that does something really challenging. And I thinka lot of our culture pushes us away from that, so

sometimes we move to the suburbs, far away from other peo- ple, becausewe thinkwewant a big yard and everything. Maybe that was a mistake, maybe we’re happier with the smaller yard surrounded by people. That’s a mistake that I think I made per- sonally. And you know, you get caught in these patterns of being self-contained.

Barbara Palmer is a senior editor of Convene. 128 pcma convene December 2011 www.pcma.org

PHOTO COURTESY OF THE ASPEN INSTITUTE