the largest turnout since the event launched in 2011. Note: Edited for space and clarity.
STN: When we’re looking at the transition from diesel
to zero emissions, and Daimler Trucks has publicly said electric is the future, is the company ready to put all its eggs into the electric basket going forward?
O’Leary: I’ll probably start by saying we don’t have
all our eggs in the zero-emissions basket. We definitely have some eggs, a lot of eggs, in that basket. But cur- rently, we have more eggs in the diesel basket because there’s still a really predominant demand for diesel. And that will continue for the foreseeable future. We’re able to walk and chew gum at the same time. We want to have the most competitive diesel offerings that we
10 percent of the big bus market, or at least it will be this year for TBB. And that will only continue to grow. There will be diesel vehicles out there for the fore- seeable future, we would say at DTNA across all applications, at least until 2039. So, it’s not going away anytime soon. And that means we’ve got to continue to have really good, efficient clean offerings on the diesel side and the zero-emission side. We need to make sure that our dealer partners are trained to be able to ser- vice and have parts stocked for both those applications. There’s a lot going on right now in both those arenas, but, you know, we want to be every bit as good in zero emission as we’ve been in diesel.
STN: You’re saying by 2039 DTNA expects to no longer of-
fer diesel in the marketplace? Or might it be sooner than that? O’Leary: It will depend, state by
“We have more eggs in the diesel basket because there’s still a really predominant demand for diesel. And that will continue for the foreseeable future.”
can as well as the most zero emissions, whether that’s battery electric, whether it’s hydrogen, or whatever. The transition I’d say is going faster on the school bus side for a number of reasons. A, it started earlier. B, there’s money out there in terms of incentives. C, it’s a depot charging application, which is typically easier to install than public charging [and] you’re going over some long 2,000-mile route. I think the application is great in terms of the mile- age that you need every day out of a bus. It’s easily met with battery electric. And even if you have to recharge between morning and afternoon sessions, you can. So, there’s a lot of things I think pointing in the right direc- tion on the school bus side that makes it easier, as well as I think there’s the whole precious cargo argument that I was so aware of when I was in that business. You know, people realize that they are carrying the future of the country and they want the best for them. And they want to have the best lowest emission vehicles that are parked outside those schools. So, again, now it’s about
state. And I won’t even talk about export markets and things like that. California has already lowered it down a little bit from the 2039. They just announced [the Advanced Clean Trucks Rule last month]. There might be other states that follow that. There are what we call opt-in states that are kind of mimicking what California is doing. It could be in some states that it’s 2035, could be another that it’s 2039. To us, it’s kind of all the same. It’s out there in the in the distant future. And so that just means we
have to continue developing the most fuel efficient and economical that we can.
STN: According to the State of Sustainable Fleets 2023
report released at the start of ACT Expo, DTNA has said it is moving away from propane, at least for Thomas Built Buses. What is the reasoning behind that?
O’Leary: In general, we as a company have to make certain decisions on where we place our bets for fu- ture engine technology. And we definitely are invested deeply on diesel. We’re obviously taking a look at gaso- line with Cummins, with the [higher] octane. And then certainly on the zero-emission side, we’ve gone in with batteries and now we’re looking at both H2 [hydrogen internal combustion engine] and fuel cell. All of those take a lot of focus and money. You have to sometimes start honing down on the ones that you think are going to be the best for your customers and for you. That’s kind of the process that we’re in right now.
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